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F#@% PAYPAL!

Posted on Wednesday, April 5th, 2006

Dave!You know... just when you think things can't get any shittier, that's usually when they do.

Thanks to a lot of hard work and the kindness of one incredibly generous person, I am very close to climbing out of the nightmare of getting my blog re-hosted. It has been a totally crappy four days, but it's almost over. Then BLAM! I get f#@%ed by PayPal!

This lovely piece of email lands in my inbox...

PayPal is committed to maintaining a safe environment for its community of buyers and sellers. Our team employs the most advanced systems in the world to protect the security of your account.
During a recent review of our system, we determined that you received funds from an account that reportedly has been associated with possible unauthorized use. In accordance with PayPal's Seller Protection Policy, the following transaction has been reversed...

WTF?!?

THEY accepted the charge, and yet it's MY problem?

And what kind of bullshit is "POSSIBLE unauthorized use"??

It's POSSIBLE that aliens have replaced world leaders with pod people. It's POSSIBLE that Elvis is still alive. It's POSSIBLE that PayPal is a giant scam. It's POSSIBLE that diamonds might shoot out of my ass...

Diamond Ass

So PayPal steals MY F#@&ING MONEY because of a "possible" problem. No proof is offered. I'm just supposed to take their word for it. No mention on whether they will reinstate my money if the charge is proved to be valid. No mention on me getting any evidence whatsoever as to this ALLEGED claim of "unauthorized use".

This is bullshit.

I wrote and asked for the evidence that this is, IN FACT, an unauthorized charge. Who knows if I will ever see it. I'm probably just f#@%ed, which is fantastic. Not only am I going to be out $12.90... I'm also out $4.05 in shipping... and $7.95 in shirt and materials.

I just had to pay hundreds of dollars to host my blog, and now T-shirts that I sell at near-cost out of the goodness of my heart, have just screwed me out of $25.

What's coming next?

UPDATE: I got an email from somebody saying: "If somebody stole YOUR credit card and bought a shirt don't you think that you should get your money back? Being ripped off by credit card thieves is part of owning a business and you need to grow up". First of all... the person who bought the shirt has no idea why the transaction was flagged as "possible unauthorized use" - NEITHER OF US DO! Even better, the buyer didn't even know that there was a problem until I wrote and told them! PayPal never bothered to contact them! So basically, PayPal says there is a "possible problem" but there is NO evidence provided to either buyer OR seller, and THAT is what I am upset about. And this is not an email scam, because the reversal of the money credit is showing up in my PayPal account. Second of all... Even if there IS fraud, "my business" WAS NOT THE ONE WHO TOOK THE CREDIT CARD! PayPal accepted the credit card! And they aren't doing it for FREE, I get billed fees every time. I mean, seriously... if I was the one who took the card and the charge was bogus... is it fair that I turn around and bill the company who printed the shirts for my loss?? No. In any event PayPal needs to provide evidence that there is wrong-doing OR GIVE ME MY MONEY BACK!!


Categories: Blogging 2006, DaveLife 2006, DaveToons 2006Click To It: Permalink
   

Comments

  1. Janet says:

    Convenient timing: paypal recently screwed me over as well. Over itunes. What the hell? If itunes isn’t “authorized”, I don’t know what is.

    I hope things get better for you.

  2. Belinda says:

    Oooh. Sorry. I’ve never had any PayPal problems, but thanks for the heads-up, since I just sold about 400 bars of soap via PP.

    And kudos on maintaining the badonkadonk even through this ordeal.

  3. Neil T. says:

    I know some people for whom PayPal works fine, and has done for years. I also know some people who regularly get ****ed over by them.

    My experience with them so far has been good, though. Hope things get better.

  4. MRKisThatKid says:

    It seems that as time goes on paypal make more and more enemies. I’ve even heard of them freezing entire merchant accounts just because they *think* some of their customers are dodgy. They’ve started acting like judge and executioner. They’ve basically garnered too much power in such little time but apparently google are going to start a similar service soon so hopefully that will put paypal in their place.

  5. Mooselet says:

    If you were me you’d have consumed your body weight in chocolate right about now. But since you’re not me, I recommend some heavy drinking this weekend.

  6. Anthony says:

    Thats shitty Dave. PayPal are muppets. Keep the faith though. :)

  7. Eve says:

    I used to always use PayPal and never had a problem. I somehow haven’t had to use them in the last 3 or so years. But just yesterday I used them to buy something off eBay and when I mentioned it to my friend, he said, “Ack, PayPal sucks! They’re a bunch of thieves!” This really sucks, I hope you get your money.

  8. Kevin says:

    Ouch. Sorry to hear, man.

    If you were to transfer the funds out of Paypal into the associated bank account, can they transfer them back to cover this or would they be SOL as they have left you?

  9. Jeff says:

    I’m assuming you’re not the victim of one of those spoof PayPal emails I get every other day.

    I was the victim, however, of a Buy.com problem. I just noticed that I’ve been charged $9.99 for the last 3 months because I agreed to a coupon deal when I placed an order earlier this year (which I didn’t). I had to make several phone calls to cancel it and am still trying to get my money back.

    The internet commerce world can be an evil place – BEWARE!

  10. John says:

    odd, awhile ago a guy tried to scam me on a website I done for him, by using someone elses credit card. The guy who owned the card started emailing me asking for the money back so I got some legal advice which said “dont give him the money back, you legally recieved money in a transaction of services. You done nothing wrong, so the money is yours. Its up to the person that got done, and the person that illegally used the card to solve the problem”.

    Basically the way I see it, is that if someone steals a £50 from my wallet and goes into town spending it, people would laugh at me if I went to every shop demanding my money back.

  11. Chaz says:

    I really have no clue how the fraud protection for credit cards or any other mediating party works, but I do know that PayPal only says they’ll provide that sort of protection on transactions up to a certain amount. If that’s the case, it boggles my mind that they seem to be providing said “protection” by simply taking back the funds associated with a certain purchase in question. If they’re just going to take the money back, why not provide 100% protection on purchases of ALL monetary denominations. Something seems a little messed up there!

  12. ms. sizzle says:

    i fucking hate pay pal with a passion. i feel your wrath! please obliterate them.

    i keep getting these bogus emails saying something about fraud and my account. it is really starting to b-u-g.

    that diamond shooting out of your ass thing? hilarious.

  13. Bec says:

    Paypal refused to pay my hosting fees automatically so I almost lost my site… (A nation weeps – w/e). Their customer support meant I had to phone them and spend 45 mins listening to some guy telling me to do all the things I had already done… And then he deleted my account for me so I could start again… It sent me into the corner of my room so I could rock back and forth for a while before I set things back up again.
    Everytime I think about it I want to cry…

  14. Craig says:

    One of Paypal’s goals is to attempt to offer both its buyers and sellers protection of their money. Occasionally mistakes are made. Nobody reading your blog nor yourself knows the exact reason for the reversal, but maybe if you let a brief amount of time pass and the investigation play out, your situation will be resolved.

    I realize that your situation has frustrated you to no end but maybe you need to revisit your analogy about the boy sitting down in the middle of the road and tieing his shoe. This time, PayPal is the boy and you are the driver getting delayed by their thoughtless action. You can either hit the gas pedal and run PayPal over now or wait for them to get done and hope they get it tied up without any knots, allowing you both to move along.

    I hate to defend them but I too am one of those who have not encountered any problems with them. In fact, my account was repaid for a non-delivered item from an alleged fraudulent seller and that action gave me more faith in them doing the right thing. Unfortunately, it did take nearly 60 days for resolution.

  15. Dave2 says:

    You’re right Craig, I don’t know what the reason is. THAT’S THE PROBLEM.

    If PayPal had said something like this, I wouldn’t have been upset at all…

    “We are sorry to inform you that there may be a problem with a recent transaction we processed for your PayPal account. ‘Big Money Bank’ has flagged the credit card as having unauthorized charges. Out of fairness to both you and the buyer, we are placing a hold on the funds until we can resolve this with the bank to be sure that this is a valid use of the buyer’s credit card. Rest assured that we will immediately reinstate your funds once the charge has been verified, or inform you of any problems if it is found to be fraudulent. We will do our best to get this situation handled as quickly as possible, and promise to keep you informed as to our progress. If you have any questions, please don’t hesitate to contact us.”

    But NOOOOOOOoooo… instead of a thoughtful letter explaining the situation, telling me what has happened, letting me know where I stand, and informing me what is going to happen. PayPal only tells me there is a “possible problem” and that the money has been removed. THAT’S IT!

    At this point, I don’t know if they are working to resolve the problem. I don’t know if I get my money back if the charge is found to be valid. I don’t even know where they are getting their information. Is it from the buyer’s bank? Is it from a credit card company? Is it from a Ouija Board? Only PayPal knows, and since they haven’t even responded to my inquiries, apparently they aren’t talking.

    I understand that sometimes there are mistakes, but this is outrageous. I should AT THE VERY LEAST be told whether or not I get my money back if there was no misuse.

    I don’t feel protected at all. I’m in contact with the buyer, and they’re not feeling very protected either (heck, PayPal never even TOLD them there was a problem!). Given the email they sent me, I have no reason to believe that this is nothing more than PayPal protecting PayPal.

    Sorry, but I have a problem with that.

  16. After thousands of Paypal transactions they now hold around $400 of my money PERMANENTLY. In one example ebay told me that an item sold to me was illegal (ebay owns paypal), I made a claim through paypal, but they are holding the money because they do not have sufficent evidence to finish processing the claim (not even Paypal believes ebay anymore). Often they “decide” to hold the money just “in case” someone else makes the same claim and if enough people do, then they will release the money – or so the Customer service people at Paypal tell me. So even if it is determined in your favor, unless Paypal decides the evidence is overwhelming, they may decide to just hold on to that money, just in case. Have to wonder how many tens of thousands of dollars Paypal is holding on to now?

  17. I hate paypal. they froze my 5 year old account last year…never gave me a reason and refuse to take my info out of their system.

    Never again.

  18. michaelsean says:

    What I want to know is… how did you come up with, “Thoom tinkle tinkle”? That will be my catch phrase for the rest of the week.

    Someone can ask me what I did today. I can response, “Well, it was a boring day. I did a little thoom tinkle tinkle then headed off the bed.”

    I can see the potential now! I could even paint it on my papier-mache penis!

  19. Dave2 says:

    “THOOM!” is the sound of the initial explosion of the diamonds blasting out my ass.

    “Tinkle Tinkle” is the sound of the diamonds dropping on the ground afterwards.

    Sound effects are important, and don’t ever let it be said that I don’t go for accuracy in my cartoons. Thanks for noticing!

    P.S. People who don’t read your blog are going to be very confused by your paper-mache penis.

  20. ash says:

    I think there’s a lot more blood if diamonds shoot out of your ass. So it’d be more like “THOOM! Tinkle Tinkle! Arrrrgh! Oh my god, the pain!!! Make it stop!! What the hell?! Oh hey, I’m rich!!! Well, just as soon as I clean these bad boys up…”
    At least that’s how I always imagined it.

  21. Randy says:

    I used this service only once in my life (I bought some very expensive bootleg concert tickets). And, continuing for many moons later I continued to get various phishing emails from them. Fortunately I changed my credit card, so they could never touch me anymore.

    What a fraudulent operation.

    If only they would just be the legit conduit they purport to be between buyer and seller…

  22. Chanakin says:

    PayPal already got sued once for that behavior…

    Whoever sent you that email needs to learn a thing or two about merchant processing and chargebacks.

  23. RW says:

    The lyric from Paul Simon… that sings about diamonds on the souls of her shoes… ok… whole new meaning…

  24. Bre says:

    Paypal and I are certainly not friends… we once had a mutual attraction, but then I fell out of love and they continue to stalk and harrass me.

    boo.

  25. Eve says:

    Since you obviously have an affinity for cartoon bare asses, I thought I’d let you know about Assy McGee, a new show coming to Adult Swim later this year.

    I wrote about it, and the other upcoming AS shows here:
    Adult Swim Brings Deth & Ass to Lineup

    One thing: Why didn’t you think of this first?

  26. Chris says:

    I’m really sorry to hear about everything that’s going on Dave, seems like life is treating you badly at the moment.

    I’m afraid your story regarding Paypal isn’t the only one. Paypal is a business that regularly holds onto money in the accounts of people who are registered with it. I’m guessing they are holding onto thousands, if not tens of thousands of pounds and dollars. They are not a bank so, cleverly, they are not under the same legal obligations as banks are. I sincerely hope you get your money back but I wouldn’t get your hopes up. Paypal are evil.

    On a lighter note, your blog is back, thank goodness for that! :D I think you should find a way to put a ‘donate’ button on your page somewhere, I’m sure your readers will gladly reimburse some of the costs you’ve had to shoulder!

  27. Wilson Ho says:

    Oh My God,

    I’m a paypal user from Hong kong for yrs, I HATE paypal so so much!!!!!! They like to reverse payment by their own decision, recently I have the worst experience, A buyer from ebay sent us$150 TO My paypal account, and week later he file a complaint to paypal saying that I never send item, as I sent the item by registered mail, I have trackling No. on hand, and I provided the trackling no. to paypal, but the next day, the worst thing happened, I find that paypal has reversed the payment of HK$150 to the buyer and caused my paypal a/c to be negative balance and suspensed my a/c becoz I have no enough funding, ask me to send a cashier order to lift my balance to positive then they will re-instate my a/c….FXCK!!!!!!!I sent over 10 e-mail to paypal support, I say th e trackling no. is valid which I can check form post office, then finally they say, Sir We discover that your trackling no. is valid, Money will be reverse to you after item showed arrived, then days later, Item arrived, And I sent e-mail to paypal to ask for the money back again, Then you know??????Nothing happened, They just say they have send an e-mail to the buyer and ask him to give you back the money!!!FXCK!!!!!AGAIN!!!!!!!Of course, the Fxcking guy never give me back the money and paypal also no help, I continuous to sent over 20 e-mail to complaint for the case, how come they can take my money from my pocket to another person and say I need to chase the money back by myself????? Fxcking experience………….PAYPL IS A BULLSHIT!!!!!!!!!!!!!I hope they can turn down the business, or more and more user will be suffered!!!!!!!!

  28. andrew says:

    10 reasons not to use paypal by eayoung34

    1) They charge sellers
    2) They only let you take out £50 or more at a time without charging a fee
    3) They take five days to credit your account on withdrawals
    4) They allow a buyer to go to dispute before they have given the post office a chance to deliver
    5) They are difficult to reach by phone
    6) Disputes take weeks to sort out
    7) Buyers use scams to get their money back, something of which Paypal does nothing to stop.
    8) They have a monopoly in the market, so they dont care about their customers
    9)They are totally unwilling to compromise in any way as a result
    10) Americans get much more favourable terms than we Brits.
    Please feel free to add to the list.

    10 reasons to use cheques
    1) Fee free
    2) no limits on deposit amounts
    3) They can credit your account next day
    4) They have been around for centuries, people know how they stand with them
    5) They can be sent from abroad thru the services of foreign clearing banks
    6) UK banks are much easier to get hold of in cases of disputes
    7) You have more control over a cheque as it is a physical thing.
    8) Cheques are not delayed by email/internet outtages
    9) You dont have to log on to know you have a cheque
    10) You have the full coverage of The Banking Ombudsman and or arbitration

    more quotes by other paypal users

    quality-guarantee says

    A)They are owned by EBay – conflict of interest.
    B) If you are scammed and go to the trouble of reporting it- they immediately freeze your account for about 3 weeks
    C) Oh and it is virtually impossible to close your account once you have one – thats 3 reasons.

    Found on a net search

    Top 3 PayPal Questions

    Can PayPal hold my money with no explanation? The answer is YES.
    Can PayPal freeze my account for no reason? The answer is YES.
    Can PayPal take money out of my account without my knowledge?
    The answer is YES.

  29. JJZ says:

    Paypal decided to give back the money to an item I sold because she claimed she didn’t receive the item. Not only am I out of the item but the $200 that was given to me. So I end up paying her to take one of my cherish collectables. I had 100% feedback on my ebay as well with blue star. I know full and damn well that item came to her. It was sent priority mail and insured! Not once did she contact me but went straight to paypal to get her money back, must of had this planned. And paypal being the middleman favored her. I am now suspended from them and from ebay since ebay owns paypal. They can kiss my ass as I will NOT pay this crook nor will I ever deal with paypal again. I find it so odd that Ebay does not have a customer telephone number, instead you must wait 24 hours before you hear a response by email and even then it’s so twisted with words you cannot understand a damn thing, nor get your point accross back to them. It’s complete shit the both of them.

  30. sherrie says:

    fuck paypal they can kiss my black ass them bitches took my money and froze my account sayin im in cahoutes with multiple aol account wtf they told me to fax in my info and i will be ok i faxed in my info and then they told me i had to pay off accounts i dont know about just because i have a aol email wtf this is bullshit fuck paypal and who ever still uses it.

  31. johnchor says:

    I recently started selling alot of items I have bought wholesale. Since I never sold a large sum before, paypal placed a hold on my account. The profits helped me get my checking account to balance and help pay for a wedding ceremony. Now, I can’t get the rest of my money being held in paypal so I can’t afford to ship the rest of the items and they’re saying I’m fraud???? F*ck paypal all the way with a cork-skrew. I’ve even given them my SS# to be able to withdraw more funds. Anyone ever beat paypal in their own game?

  32. paypal is a scam says:

    Got a problem with paypal?Tell them about it.
    Complaint-response@paypal.com
    Ive sent them atleast 30 emails and at this address they answer every one.Usually with a prewritten response but atleast they actually have to read you telling them to go fuck themselves.Want to send it anonomously?Then get torpark and set up a hotmail account.

  33. Dr Zod says:

    12 bucks? from your level of anger i would have thought you lost your life savings….im guessing since this is 06 they have refunded your 12 bucks and everything is fine…but you didn’t update so im guessing. holy crap…i just found 12 dollars in my couch. ill send you the money, wait, if i go back in time 6 yrs from now, what would the interest be on that. ….hmm lets check the CPI or consumer price index…actually i would have to bring you 13.40 based on the CPI relative to 12 dollars in 2006 if i were to travel back in time from 2012 with my 12 dollars…so..unfortunately i would be 1.40 short. since…i don’t want to go through the hassle of time travel just to show up a buck forty short, i think ill stay here. but….here’s an idea. what if…i were to travel back to 2000 and put that 12.00 in your couch…lets check the figures…..yep i think we have it. if i do that, take 12 dollars back to your couch…in 2000 and you find it in 2006 you get 14.00!! not bad…ok thats worth 2 bucks….

    • Dave2 says:

      Do you work for PayPal? Are you high? Or do you just randomly troll websites so you can make absurd comments that completely miss the point of the matter at hand? PAYPAL FUCKING STOLE FROM ME! It doesn’t matter if it was 50¢ or $5000… it’s the PRINCIPLE OF SOMEBODY HAVING STOLE MY MONEY. And while you may not understand such concepts as “principles” and “integrity,” these are important ideals for people who wish to conduct business honorably. Though, granted, “honor” may also be outside your ability to fathom since you spend all your time and energy focused on mere money being the only reason somebody would be pissed at having been wronged.

      But even if money was the driving force behind my “level of anger.” You’re still missing the point. As I said, I never got my merchandise returned, so I lost $25, not $12. PLUS the hours I wasted trying to get the situation sorted out with PayPal… NOT because of the money… but because I trying to solve a problem with MY CUSTOMER. As I also said (if you had bothered to read it) my customer was trying to get things sorted out with THEIR bank, so I was obligated to do what I could from my end. Though, again, “obligation” is probably yet another foreign concept for somebody who thinks this could have possibly been just about the “12 bucks.”

      And, no, PayPal never did refund my money. They never did explain why they had rescinded payment. They never did contact my customer. They never did tell me on whose authority the refund was requested. To my knowledge, they never even contacted the bank whom they claimed made the “possible problem” request. Hell, to this day I don’t even know if PayPal themselves figured out if the “possible problem” was an actual problem or where it originated. So far as I know, they could have invented the entire thing. This was after MONTHS of communication via phone, fax, and email in an attempt to get the situation resolved for my customer. Eventually, PayPal stopped responding and refused to answer any further questions on the matter.

      So, ultimately, this had nothing to do with the amount of money I lost. It was a warning to anybody doing business with PayPal that PayPal can AT ANY TIME AND WITH NO EXPLANATION STEAL YOUR MONEY. Maybe my measly $25 doesn’t mean anything to a time-traveling financial wizard like yourself… but what about the person who has $250 taken because of a “possible problem?” $2500? $5,000? Is that enough to get angry about? Is that something you dig out of your couch cushions?

      Why don’t you use your time machine to go back and get yourself some principles. Perhaps then you’d understand that there’s things worth getting angry about that go beyond dollars and cents.

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